THE SUMMARY

Founded in 1959 to honor excellence in advertising, The Clio Awards celebrates bold, creative work that inspires ideas and fosters meaningful connections within the creative community. Today, Clio Cannabis celebrates the creators at the forefront of cannabis marketing and communications. The Clio Cannabis Awards sets the bar for creative work in a rapidly growing industry, builds a greater understanding of a developing category, and elevates creative contributions from top talent and agencies

THE CO-HOSTS

David Paleschuck, Adriana Hemans

THE SPECIAL GUEST

Michael Kauffman, Executive Director, Clio Music & Clio Cannabis

THE TRANSCRIPT

David Paleschuck

Welcome to Branding Bud Live, the live stream that’s 100% THC and 0% WTF.  Every week we speak with business people about the business of cannabis. I’m David Paleschuck, founder of Branding Bud Consulting Group and author of the first book on cannabis branding. I’m joined by my co-host Adriana Hemans, a Marketing executive with over 8 years in the cannabis space. Hi Adriana! 

Adriana Hemans

Hi David. Thank you for that intro. I’m so excited to co-host the show with you. We’re bringing amazing guests from across the cannabis ecosystem to share their perspectives. My favorite thing about Branding Bud Live is that we focus on building community - and we encourage audience participation. It’s not just about us talking, it’s about all of us building something together. So feel free to drop your questions and/or opinions in the chat, and we’ll share them too. 

David Paleschuck

Thank you, Adriana. And thank you, everyone, for joining us today. We have a lot of hot topics to get into today. Today, our topic is, “Cannabis: What Makes A Winning Brand?”. Some of the topics we’ll cover are: 

• What piques cannabis consumers' interests? 

• What makes a winning cannabis brand?

• Are there any similarities across CLIO Cannabis winners? 

Our guest today is Michael Kauffman, Executive Director, Clio Music & Clio Cannabis. I’m excited to have him on the show today. 

Adriana Hemans 

Me too! Let’s welcome them onto the show. Hi, Michael! We have a lot to cover today. So let's just jump in. I want to start by asking a question that we ask all of our guests. And I love to hear because we're so passionate in this industry. Right. So let's hear from you. What are you passionate about? 

Michael Kauffman 

Well, I'm passionate about music and cannabis. So I have like a good job because I have those in my title. Of course, I'm passionate about dogs. I'm passionate about travel. I love a great cocktail. I do love to eat. I think we all love to eat. I'm a big fan of pizza. I like to joke that if we had Clio pizza, and I could do Clio, musically or cannabis include pizza, like I'd be set right. I'm also a fan of jukeboxes. I have a 1953 Ami jukebox. I love just the stories behind things. I think that's probably a thread. So, you know, for me, hearing the stories behind cannabis brands and cannabis strains and the people working in the business like that. That is really meaningful to me. And that that is something that's really important. And you know, just like the stories behind wine or pizza or jukeboxes, or whatever, or music or songs, that's certainly something I love stories back story. 

Adriana Hemans 

Remember, Yes, that sounds like fun. 

David Paleschuck 

Pizza and stories … what's not to like? So let's just to set the tone here, right before we get into because this is obviously a cannabis focus show. But before we get into that, would you mind just giving us a little history about the Clio Award? 

Michael Kauffman 

Yeah, be glad to. Yeah, as you said, Clio, started in 1959, really a global competition for the creative side of the business focused on advertising. In fact, we've been called the Oscars of advertising that sort of frames it for a lot of people. And over those decades, it was really about the best print ads, the best commercials, I think into the 80s and early 90s, you would, you'd watch the Clio Awards on TV, the, in fact, if you go on YouTube, you can find old Clio Award shows on TV hosted by Kelsey Grammar, or Vanna White, or different folks of that sort. That's been a thread for many years, it's how do we elevate the most creative work that's happening in advertising and marketing, probably about 10 years ago, or so now that Clio’s really started to think about ours is their creative work happening in other spaces and other industries that that we could elevate that we can highlight that we could bring this process that we've built, the systems and the way we do judging and the democratic process that we have, like, bring that to other spaces. So I think Clio health was one of the first sort of programs launched under the Clio umbrella beyond the main program. There was a time when we were owned by the same parent company that owned the Hollywood Reporter, and some other entities had an Award show that they had inherited, called the key art Awards that were for movie and TV. And they said, Well, why are we running an Award show, and we have a partner in the family that runs Awards, and they kind of pass it over to Clio. And that became Clio entertainment, which is still a very, very big show and program for us focuses on TV film, gaming. That show every year happens in person at the Dolby and LA, which is a cool place to do shows. And that was kind of the start of looking at other industries. We now subsequently have a total of six programs, Clio, Clio entertainment, Clio health, Clio sports, obviously, what it sounds like, and then Clio music and Clio cannabis are the two that I oversee Clio music launched in 2014. And Clio cannabis launched in 2019. And I think the thread through the mall is recognizing the creative side of the business, every program is a little different. For example, in music, we recognize things like music video, which you don't have in other spaces, but we really try to focus on the marketing, advertising design creative part of the business. So launching Clio cannabis, that's our focus, we are not like, some great competition like the Emerald Cup, or what Hi, time says that focuses on, the product, or the strain or the flower, we're about what's around that the creativity, bringing that to market and connecting with an audience and building a brand and that sort of thing. So that's kind of the snapshot, I think Clio is something that a lot of people have heard of, because it's certainly been in pop culture. You mentioned madmen. There's some great episodes of Madmen where, Don Draper left is Clio Award in a bar somewhere, which I still think it would be a cool thing for us to play off like, hide at Clio somewhere that was Don Draper's Clio, right. For us is like a privilege to be in these new spaces. And I think, coming into the cannabis space was something that we felt really, supportive, and we thought it was an important thing for us to do. So that sort of how we kind of got up to the present day with all these six different programs. 

Adriana Hemans 

And so why is cannabis, its own category? I mean, you mentioned that there's a lot of different spin offs in different categories at all, sort of share that Clio branding, but is there something unique about advertising and cannabis that, has it separated as its own category?

Michael Kauffman 

I think when we launched the program, we were starting to see some really interesting work being done. And I'm sure some of this everybody, that's involved. By the way, I love seeing everybody that's on the call. Hi, Carrie. And I know there's others. Maybe my Uncle Joe was on, I hope, I think we were starting to see some really interesting creative work that was happening a year probably some of you remember, some of the early things that med men did, where they had Spike Jonez do a really remarkable piece of film. We were seeing some interesting stuff from Houseplant and Dosist, Weedmaps, some of those things were surfacing. And we thought, you know, this is a really interesting creative space that we should consider. And at the time, our, our CEO, Nicole Purcell was, had a relationship with a gentleman named Craig Fox, who was running high times for a period of time and they had a conversation and that we thought, let's kind of collaborate and figure out how to launch this program. They were our media partner initially. They, you know, it was great, because we got to, you know, hear from the expertise of some of the folks there like John Capetta who is still someone I really respect and admire. In fact, shout out to John, he does that stone cold cop list that he's been doing since COVID, like every week, where he recommends great strains and products, and it's awesome. So thank you for that, John. But, you know, it gave us a way to launch the program. Well, there we go. I'll tell you what that picture is in a second. But yes, you have to show that we launched in 2019. That was our first year. This is now our fifth year that we're in currently. You know, this picture was from last year, when we did the Award show, we were fortunate to be able to present the Awards live at a conference called a MJ Unpacked that was in Las Vegas. Actually, ironically, it's happening right now. And yeah, which is awesome. And we love George in the team there. And I know they're having a great conference. But we did the show where we presented the winners on stage, the top winners, and some honorary Clio’s at the MGM Grand in Las Vegas. And really, since you're in Las Vegas, there's probably nothing, most of us aspire to do more than to wear an Elvis costume which I actually had done once earlier in my career when I worked at a record label and we were putting out an Elvis records I Dressed as Elvis so I've experienced wearing the Elvis costume. But that was on stage. That was when we were kicking off the Award show in Las Vegas last fall. It was a fun time was a great night. It was great to see everybody that, having the community there. 

Michael Kauffman 

It was a special night because I think the experience of seeing work in a community setting almost like in a movie theater is really a wonderful experience, and you also realize that there's so much creative work being done that maybe you weren't even aware of. I mean, I know at the show this year, past year, we had winners that were global. We had two grand winners from Germany and I would guess probably some of that work people in the room had not seen before. So that was exciting for me to be able to present winners, and the winning work and real To amplify and highlight the people behind it, so I love that picture. I will probably never have another picture addressing Elvis that was actually an Ad Week, which I like to feel like that was on a bucket list to be an Ad Week with a picture of myself dressed as Elvis. So there we go. 

Adriana Hemans 

It is really special seeing those ads on the big screen. And I want to call it a comment from Paula who said Clio did a great job picking the cannabis brand of the year which was great to see their creative on the big screen at that event, too. 

Michael Kauffman 

Yeah, well, and just to that point, we have systems that the Clio’s have built and used in all our programs, and are of the Year Awards, which this last year was the first time we did it in cannabis are really based on a point system for a number of trophies that a company wins. In the case of Cann, kudos to the team. I mean, Luke and the team there have done just tremendous work. And I think, they submit it, they've been recognized they've been Awarded, we really empower a jury to make the decisions and determine the Awards, which of course, we can touch on a little later. But it was a privilege to present it to Canada, it was really special to have, Luke and Ashley and the whole team there to get up. That was a very emotional and meaningful moment. So I'm glad that they could be recognized like that. 

David Paleschuck 

It was I remember the emotion, especially as Luke was receiving. Boy, I just want to call out I have to I see so many people. Aaron Salles is here from MOCA Humboldt. Michael Rosenfeld just joined in a moment ago. So it's like a little party here. We've got all the other folks that are here. It's a great little party. I appreciate everybody for showing up. Michael, let's just talk quickly about I guess, what makes a successful cannabis brands, at least include it in, at least in clear terms? Right? Could you talk about maybe some of the winners and what makes a great brand? You just spoke about cam for a moment ago, but there are some others as well? 

Michael Kauffman 

Yeah, well, I mean, literally, what makes a successful brand in an Awards program, like Clio is how you define how the jury evaluates the work and for us, it is solely on one thing, and that's creativity, which sounds simple, but, is, as I think, many of you probably would think like, you all have different ways of looking at creativity. I mean, we really try to focus our juries on thinking about it in a way that, is this work bold? Is it innovative is this work that we want to recognize that helps move the industry forward? Is this work that I wish my team worked on, that's how we frame creativity, that it's something imaginative, unexpected, that, just deliver some emotion and a message. So, for us, what makes a winning brand is literally creative work that cuts through the clutter. It's creative work that a jury recognizes, it's, it's creative work that your peers recognize and want to amplify. And that is obviously different for different companies, different brands, the way they execute that. I think what's remarkable to me is, is creativity comes from all of us. Each of us, anybody has great ideas, and I think the work that comes in, whether it's from a dispensary, or from a brand or from an agency that's doing the work on behalf of a client, there's just amazing creative work, you look at the Grand winners, let's say from last year, we talked about the of the year with Cann but really interesting, diverse work, but all the thread is very creative. We had an agency out of Germany, Jung von Matt, that was doing work with the basically the Berlin Metropolitan Transit Authority, and they made edible train tickets, hemp tickets that you could eat, that had, I guess, some sort of CBD in them that would sort of mellow people out. They weren't THC tickets, unfortunately. But it was their way to communicate a message to the audience in Germany, where I think they're still trying to pass legislation to make things legal, but I think created awareness and understanding in a creative way. You look at, what Weedmaps did, where they were acknowledged for their, the Brock Ollie campaign, which is really clever and funny, and also incredibly creative, incredibly in line with, the messaging that they as a company and brand are espousing. You look at, Missouri's own edibles the company out of St. Louis. I had a brilliant idea of, okay, everybody's doing edibles, how do we do something creative and different. So they ended up doing things with a local company, a local company that made these red hot Riblet, potato chips, you know, infused like, which, right now are making my mouth salivate. I wish I had some of them, right. And they also then did some edibles where they worked with a local fruit, something I never heard of called the Paw Paw fruit. Have you ever heard of the Paw Paw fruit? I think unless you're from Missouri, maybe it's a local, but they made edibles that were flavored by Paul for it, you know, and I think that too, is a way to be creative, a way to connect to your community locally. You know, they certainly did a great job with that, you know, one of the other grand winners, Arroyo, you know, built packaging that was able to communicate a message to allow people to find, you know, folks that are in prison that should not be in prison and activated them to respond to try to help get those people out of prison. And they made that packaging, able to be used by any company, any brand, you know, any dispensary. I think that too, is a creative way to address a problem. And I think those are very, very unique and different things. You know, you know, similar to Cann, that we talked about who does incredibly creative film and video work, you know, very supportive of the LGBTQ plus community, very visually appealing, you know, clever, funny, song and dance stuff. They're all very different. But there's a cool thread of creativity through them. And obviously, the collective jury determined that those things were all exemplary as well. So is probably a long winded way of not answering your question to me, like what makes a cannabis brand successful? You know, I think it is creatively addressing who you are as a company as a people who your audience is, and then how do you communicate that and connect? And for us, it's not about ROI. It's not about results. It really is about the creative idea, you know, what is that idea that's going to move the ball forward. And, you know, I, I keep coming back, you know, as I go to different Clio programs that we have, we had our main Clio Award show this week, here in New York, you see work that's done, where the realization is, creativity is the thing that can change minds. Creativity is the thing that can hopefully fix some of these like ills that we have some of these big challenges that are so hard to figure out how to get beyond in the cannabis space, for example, like creativity as a way to move forward to make people think about things differently, whether you're making them laugh, or making them cry, or whatever it is. I think it's part of what's going to get us forward. So I think it's a privilege for us to be involved with that. And that's certainly part of what makes a cannabis brand successful. 

David Paleschuck 

I was a judge this year. Thank you. We bet you. If I recall correctly, there were 18 people on the call three of them worked at the Clio clear Awards, including you so to others, and there were 15 judges, we spent five hours on the phone debating, and dare I even say, he did lead debating what was, you know, what was deemed creative? And why should these Awards win, and people were very diverse, you know, from all over all walks of life. And it was great, because I certainly had my perspectives, but just to hear other people's perspectives, and sort of, you know, sort of scratch my head and say, Wow, I never ever thought about that. That's pretty cool. And then to see what we came up with collectively as, as a group for the winners, and the people that placed was pretty phenomenal. That process was pretty amazing. It was almost like the United Nations of candidates, which was pretty exciting to be a part of. 

Michael Kauffman 

We really appreciate you being on the jury, we work really hard to have a lot of different points of view in that space, that are from brands, agencies, dispensaries, you know, in the industry, I think the interesting thing too, in cannabis is, this is a culture and a community that has been around, you know, for decades, if not centuries, really. And unlike maybe a lot of the other Clio programs, some of that creativity has certainly been outside of like the traditional agency or brand realm, I mean, that creativity has been in cultivation. And, you know, I always try to have, you know, some of that point of view represented, you know, we had, for example, Mario Guzman was on the jury, one of the first years so I'm sure Minsky's who is just fantastic. And I think to your point, David, it's just important to have those different points of view in that conversation. We do go through a few rounds, where collectively the jury votes on Have things and then it does ultimately get to that stage, as David's pointing out where you have a conversation, you look at the results, things move around on the scoreboard. And, you know, ultimately, certainly not everything. That's great wins. There's so much great stuff that gets submitted. But I do believe that it's democratic, it's fair. And when you get to the winners, the winners are all really great, really good. That's not to say everything good wins. But it's still, I think, a process that is very fair, you can't pay to win at Clio, you know. And I think having people like you, David, that are such an expert. I think it's interesting hearing you say like, you hear things in the room that you kind of didn't consider that perspective, which, you know, I find to it's almost like a masterclass in branding and marketing. When you get in that jury room. I wish we could sort of bottle that somehow and use that, because it's really fascinating and really educational and inspiring. Agreed. 

David Paleschuck 

It is a great process. And it's a great way to get people on the same page. And even if at the end, they're not on the same page, the process, pull them through, they understood the process. And that's why the answers are what you know, that's why the winners are, who the winners are. And I think that's really meaningful to for the winners themselves to understand that was that process.

Michael Kauffman 

But yeah, so I want to just comment on that. Because I do think, you know, when I started the Clio’s I remember our head of marketing, Brooke, talking to her, and I'm like, you know, still trying to figure out what this business is what this company is because I came from, like the record business and, and I remember Brooks said something that has stuck with me that I still come back to and that is we are in the morale business. You know, and I think to your point, it's like recognizing people. It's such a privilege, but it also has such value because we all should be recognized for great work, we're doing you know, I think for us at Clio is helping amplify and uplift teams and companies and people. And that's certainly something that I think is really important and meaningful. So I'm, I'm honored and glad that we can be a part of that. 

David Paleschuck 

Every week, we have an audience participation. We're a few of them, actually. And we're super excited today, because we've got one, really about Awards. And so our next slide is coming up. This is our CannaChoice for the day.

Adriana Hemans  

So is it a big Grammy? And God, everybody knows what the Grammy is, is it be the Foot and Mouth Award and Foot and Mouth Award? Well, we'll go through all of them. The Foot In Mouth Award B, or the Kweef, C? or D, The Bent Spoon is not a real Award.

David Paleschuck 

That's right. And we're curious to know which one is not the real one. So as Michael is thinking about that, we'd love to have the audience chime in. 

Adriana Hemans 

And if you get, you’re just not paying attention. That's right. 

Michael Kauffman 

And by the way, I think the Grammys, I should have somebody fact check this, but I think the Grammys and the Clio’s maybe started the same year as far as Awards shows. So somebody should fact check that somebody Google that while we're on. 

David Paleschuck 

Yeah, so that would mean the Grammys started in 1959 is 39. 

Michael Kauffman 

Yeah, I could be misremembering; it could be another word. It could be the foot and mouth and word I don't remember.

David Paleschuck 

Well, we have two votes. So far. Elena and Carrie, thank you. 

Adriana Hemans 

Were first Awarded in 1958. All right, close. 

David Paleschuck 

So close … Ye, so far.

Adriana Hemans 

Aaron said the Grammys are fake news. 

David Paleschuck 

Seems like everything is fake news these days. 

Michael Kauffman 

We should they said the Grammys need to let us run. Run the Grammy. You know I think Clio systems are very fair. We'd be honored to run the Grammys. We actually just announced recently removing the Clio Music Awards Program. An Award show to Los Angeles during Grammy week this next coming year and basically ended January, early February. So I'm excited about that. Oh, cool. So we did just clarify that the Grammys are obviously real, because where's the Grammy week? So that answer is off the table. 

David Paleschuck 

All right, well, so here's let's just go through it quickly then. So everybody knows what the Grammys is. So by deductive reasoning what the Foot and Mouth is, I think it isn't. So I think gold is the is really the most baffling comment by a public figure. That's given every year. So there's that. You know, my research shows me to the Queen is a new Award that Queen Latifah has come out with for, for new women hip hop artists called the Kweef sponsored by Queen Latifah. And in the Bent Spoon Award, which is an Australian Award for the most preposterous pseudo-scientific finding.

Adriana Hemans 

We have two votes for a one vote for B foot and mouth and three votes for C. 

David Paleschuck 

All right, well, let's jump to it. Because we're talking about Awards. Let's just get right to the answer, shall we?

Michael Kauffman 

I thought I actually I misread, I thought it was the Keith and I thought it was a Keith Richards thing. And who actually is a Clio Music Award winner we, there was a word that the jury gave to the box that the talk is cheap, 30th anniversary box set. And that was a couple years ago, but I just remember feeling so excited that Keith Richards was getting a Clio. So it was the Keith, you know. 

David Paleschuck 

Not the Queen, nor the Keith, which is also cannabis related. So not to be confused right here.

Adriana Hemans 

Yeah. Oh, and I want to say if anyone in the audience has a question for Michael, feel free to drop it in. And we will go ahead and ask him and you can get your question answered about creativity, or the Clio’s or branding. There's like so, so much to talk about here. So question for you, Michael. We talked a little bit about creativity and some of those interesting campaigns, including edible tickets. And I think sort of the underlying focus of today is there are so many hurdles that cannabis marketers and advertisers have to go through traditional channels are just sort of closed down to us at least right now. So creativity really has to work well to kind of cut through the noise. Do you see? Maybe you could share with us like, how you see the evolution of advertising for the cannabis industry? 

Michael Kauffman 

Well, that big question. You know, I look at the work that comes in. So you know, my frame of reference is, is kind of focused on that. And I do think that looking once again, at things that have been Awarded and recognized by the jury, there is an authenticity there is a storytelling that resonates there is the power of an idea that does cut through things, to use the words that you use. And you know, I, I think it's interesting to see that, you know, on a local level, that's possible when you see what Missouri's own animals did, by using sort of local connection. And on a grander scale. What you know, brands like Cann are doing, I mean, they are just truly focused on what is authentic to us. What is going to resonate, you know, I always think like, what turns me on what resonates me and I think, like, brilliant marketing people. I mean, David is one that has done this again, and then again, in his career, it's like, you know, I think probably David, you have thought of things that have, it's like, this resonates with me, so there's going to be people else that resonates with you know, and I think that's been a thread seeing that attention to detail, you know, things that catch the eye. You know, I look at our design winners that we look at, you know, certainly can I mean, Klaus was a beverage that was Awarded a bunch of Awards in design, sure. Minsky's, you know, I mentioned the arroyo freedom grands grand winner, you know, that's a design thing. I mean, loon Farnsworth, I'm thinking of all the design ones, like, what do they have in common? Well, there's just attention to detail eye catching work. You know, when I was in the music business, I remember we used to do a thing back when we were selling those round shiny things, and our members compact discs feels like a lifetime ago. But you know that compact disc cover was like this big. And so we would take the design and somebody would stand over on the other side of the room, and we'd be like, can you see what this is? And you tell what it is? And you know, it's kind of a simple thing, but I think even in the case of design winners, for the most part that I Have seen for us that that resonate, it's work that cuts through, it's probably work that 10 feet away, you're be like that is Klaus or that, you know, it's something that, you know, it communicates a message effectively in a way that you're, you're you know what it is, you know, especially if you experienced it, I would say and I think this is probably not something that anybody would disagree with. But it does always really start with a quality product, though, you know, there's really only so far you can go unless what you're making is this quality is genuine is authentic. So I think it builds from there. And certainly a lot of those companies and brands that I just mentioned, I think are doing that. And I also believe that we're seeing more attention, you know, I know Kary was on and I see what Kary is doing with sustainable packaging, I think there's things like that, that we're now seeing that are part of the evolution of marketing in this space, that are really important and really critical. And smart. I mean, they're smart marketing, but they're also smart for the earth and smart for all of us. So, you know, I think there's a couple of things that come to mind. David, do you have any thoughts on that? 

David Paleschuck 

I think today, the successful brands are really about community and shared experience, you know, which really come back to trust, which come back to a whole bunch of other things, you know, so I think those brands that, you know, that understand the community speaking in a certain tone, understand the messaging, speak the language, are of that community, or authentic or credible or relevant. I'm using all the words I hate. Though, those are the things that are most important, and, and when you have shared experiences, and you've come from the same community, it comes naturally, you don't really need to think about it. It's not contrived, right? 

Michael Kauffman 

I completely love and I love the fact that you're like we're using these buzzwords, which I agree sometimes it's like we resort to this, this verbiage that is outdated, or whatever. But I think to about some of the winners that are dispensaries, you know, green Queen would the woods in West Hollywood, Willow, they are so unique and have created a sort of an environment in a community in there, like retail space that I think is also meaningful and important. And all that said, That's not to say you're going to be successful, because it certainly is very challenging. You have all those other encumbrances that we know that are hurdles in this space that are not in every other space. But I think that's what you have to do to have a fighting chance. And, you know, I love going to those environments. I mean, last time I was in LA, I went to all three of those, I went to green queen and woods and Willow and all just really unique and I had to do a lot of shopping. And I listened to a lot of great opinions about stuff. And it was fun. I loved it. 

David Paleschuck 

Can you talk a little bit maybe about, you know, some of the smaller markets or work? How did some of the smaller brands navigate this? And can I just throw in that? I believe some of the small brands and the small markets can also be a part of the Clio was right? It's not, it's not just for the bigger brands or the bigger agencies, right? You're, you're open to creative work. Is that correct? 

Michael Kauffman 

Yeah, we're open to anybody involved in work and submit it. And we certainly see the spectrum of types of companies and individuals that enter work. You know, I've used a couple times, you know, the Missouri's own edibles example, but that's, you know, a local brand. Similarly, like we saw entries come in X us this year, for the first time from Israel, from Croatia, from Germany, as I mentioned earlier, Brazil. So I think there's creative things happening in a lot of spaces. And to your point, David, like, ideas come from all of us, you know, creative ideas come from you at a dispensary or you at a small brand. I mean, some of the packaging stuff. That's one is certainly not big companies. It's stuff that's in one state. So I think that is an important thing to note that Clio’s are, are open to any and all and really the fundamental thing is, is it creative, and I like to say to people, like think about the one thing or the couple things that you've done creatively with your company, with your brand with your product, whatever it is, that you can't stop talking about, you know, that thing that you just think was so cool, because that's probably a really great creative idea, and that's the kind of stuff that I think you should enter in Because to cannabis program because that's, that's the kind of work that we want to uplift and amplify. So that's the conversation starter. 

Adriana Hemans 

So since we're talking about international, some of the ads you mentioned are from outside of the US. Let's jump to our audience participation, because this is related to an international question. So hooks, true or false. cannabis is legal in the Netherlands. Yeah. 

Michael Kauffman 

What do you think? Try to remember the recent Ted Lasso episode that they shot, which was such a brilliant episode that they were in Amsterdam. I'm trying to remember what it was a brilliant episode. 

David Paleschuck 

I missed that one. But, but at the very least, you have a 50 5050 50% chance of getting it right. Audience What do you think? Is cannabis legal in the Netherlands? God knows I've been to Amsterdam … an awful lot. 

Adriana Hemans 

We got two guesses for false from Frank and Charlene and Sharon leads on a roll today. So she might have she might have a double header here. Becky, guest false, also illegal. Hey, Becky. I have a vote for No, I'm not sure what no means? I guess that means false. 

Michael Kauffman 

Do you tell people they can't google it while you're doing this? 

Adriana Hemans 

We operate on the honor system. 

David Paleschuck 

All right, let's go to the answer.

Adriana Hemans 

Let's not leave everyone in suspense any longer. 

David Paleschuck 

And the answer is calls. And they got it right. Yeah, they've never legally formally legalized cannabis. Excuse me. And since 1976, they've not enforced laws against the possession of small amounts of cannabis. However, growing, distributing and importing, also known as smuggling.

Adriana Hemans 

I wanted to go back to a question that Elena asked about has Have there been any Awards for merchandise? I'm curious about that myself. 

Michael Kauffman 

Well, you know, there was a project I remember the first year you know, Willie's company. GCH had submitted something that they did for the last prisoner project. That was a piece of merch that was Awarded. And, you know, I think that's another corollary that is important that I've seen that I really liked to see that we've seen a lot of companies trying to, you know, address social issues. And, you know, we certainly have tried to amplify some of the work that's being done by giving on a very close we gave one to last prisoner project few years ago. Last year, we gave one to headcounts cannabis voter project, I think it's important to, you know, lift up those companies that are doing that work, but that was, you know, that's one that comes to mind. You know, certainly, you can go on to Clio cannabis Awards, and.com. And you can search through all the winners for the last couple of years, you can actually not only search by year, but you can search by medium, so you can search for design or whatever it might be, you know, printing out of home, that kind of thing. But, but the Willie, the Willie, last prisoner project, I think it was a t shirt, and there was probably some other collaterally they did that one comes to mind. So yes, answer is yes.

David Paleschuck 

T shirts, apparel and edible tickets for buses in Germany. Right. So Michael, you know you're at the at the forefront of all these Award winning brands down all these Award winning cannabis brands to be specific. Can you just sort of maybe give us a look into the future? Is there anything you see that you know, from the winning brands? Are there is there a threat? Are there any trends? Is there anything that you sort of see forthcoming? 

Michael Kauffman 

Great question. You know, I wouldn't say I'm at the forefront. I think the people that are on this call are at the forefront that people that are doing the work are at the forefront, I think we're helping to amplify and recognize that and not just with the words, but we also have an editorial platform called news that we have weekly Q&A's with people in the industry. And I think there's a couple things that strike me that I've been seeing, you know, and one of them I touched on briefly like think we're really starting to see a lot more global entries come in. I mean, last year, having like I said, Croatia, Israel, Brazil, Germany, entries from places that are x, US and Canada. That I think is a trend that will continue. There's certainly, I mean, horrific things still happening in this world. I mean, I know the recent thing going on, I believe in Singapore, is awful that, you know, we as a community need to find ways to help move the ball forward. But I think that the global change that's happening is also going to be reflected in the work that we see the comment that comes in. I think the other area that is really intriguing to me, you know, because I work with a team here that does all these other programs, sports and health. Anytime I go to something with some of my colleagues, or at a dinner or an event, and people find out that I do music and cannabis, they want to know what's happening in cannabis, I think that there's an opportunity for collaborations that we're going to see explode. I think, seeing what, you know, Charlotte's Web, their deal with MLB, I think is huge. And I think those are the kinds of things as our culture becomes better educated about this plant and its importance and its meaning and how it can help that is going to create more and more opposition, you know, opportunities for partnerships and collaborations that are, you know, beyond what we've seen yet. I think that that is coming and is here already. I mean, certainly music and cannabis go together. And, you know, we talk about that here internally to like, can we do more events where we bring communities together, the creative communities from music, sports, and cannabis, I think would be really awesome. Because I think that that, you know, that's going to produce creative work, and it's going to produce things that, you know, wouldn't be possible. If you're just in your own lane, I think getting out. And even, you know, I think other companies and industries can benefit by looking at the winners in the cannabis space. Similar to what I encourage people to go and look at the winners and all the other Clio programs, because you see things that just are such great ideas that either inspire you or give you an idea, you can use that idea in a different way remix it. You know, I love that. I mean, there's, there's two I want to mention, because they have stuck with me, there was a clear sports winner a few years ago, that was really the Minnesota Wild, I think it is the hockey team, they basically did a thing in their community where you know, Minnesota lands, 1000 lakes or 10,000, lakes, whatever it is, and they asked people to bring water from their local lake, to the stadium. And they poured it into this big machine, that that water went into the ice and all that water became part of the ice for their hockey team. Like what a great idea. Unity, right? And I think if you look at people doing work in other spaces, you're going to see stuff like that be like, Alright, is there something there we can do? I mean, not if you don't have a hockey team and ice, but there's a concept there that I think resonates. There was also a musician, an independent musician from Belgium, who did a piece where he went on tour and all these like chronic venues, Madison Square Garden, the forum, but he played like Madison Square Garden coffee shop. And, you know, he found venue, small venues that had the same name. And then he did a tour, and he did a whole promotion about playing these venues. I thought that was a creative and brilliant idea. So I think looking at other spaces is good. And that sort of ties to my collaboration point. I think, David?

David Paleschuck 

I think he hit the nail on the head, which, is the future of moving toward normalization is really everything brands partnering with cannabis brands, and working on partnerships and collaborations. Like the one you mentioned, which does lead us to, to a place further down the road, closer to acceptance closer to normalization, again, a few of the buzzwords I tried to avoid. But with the amount of time we have left, why not just go for the buzzwords. So that said, Michael, what you're doing, again, we thank you for it really elevates our game. And what we do, you know, being recognized by the Clio Awards is something really special. And for the folks that are in the industry, we need that we need that normalization, we need that recognition. And damn, it's just nice to be loved and recognized, isn't it? So? So we thank You. We thank you for what you do. And we look forward to hearing about Clio Awards more the Clio cannabis Awards more, as well as the Clio Music Awards, as you call that earlier. One last thing. Where can people find out more about the Clio cannabis Award if they want to submit their work? For the upcoming Award. 

Michael Kauffman 

Yeah, well, and thank you guys first for doing this and for inviting me I really am honored to be on the show. I love what both of you are doing. And really kudos everybody that's tuned in, you know, for the work that they're doing. Clio, cannabis Awards.com, you can go there, you can go to the Clio site at www.clios.com. And you'll see all the programs, you'll see cannabis at the top among sports, you know, music etc. You know, we are open for entries right now. Our next deadline is May 26. And then we have a final deadline, July 21, the entry fee goes up slightly. So if you enter earlier, it's saves you some money. I also encourage you to go on and look at Winners that we talked about, but also go to Muse by Clio. He's by Clio.com, which is our editorial site. And you'll see there's really great content about all the different creative work happening across the spaces we're in. And today we had another Q&A with someone in the cannabis space. That was really a great read. So check that out as well. 

David Paleschuck 

Perfect. Yeah, we really appreciate you joining us today, and really appreciate what you do. So keep doing it. And we'll see you soon. 

Adriana Hemans 

Thanks, Michael.

David Paleschuck 

Thank you. Well, as always, that was pretty amazing. We always seem to have great guests with great stories that are doing great things. And we're appreciative that that they could come and join us and all the folks that come in and listen to us every week. We're super excited. Next week's show is titled flower in fashion. And we'll be speaking with Brett Heyman, who is the founder of flower by Ed Parker. And we are super excited to chat with her about the interconnection and the intersection of fashion and cannabis. So join us next week next Thursday. 11am PST 2pm ESD. Thank you, Adriana. Thank you, Michael. Thank you everybody for listening. And don't forget to check out cannabis is best kept secret at www.brandingbud.com.

Adriana Hemans 

Thanks, everyone. Bye.

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